Today Programme, 3/9/04
John Humphries (presenter), Richard West (The Vacuum), Councillor Eric Smyth |
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| John Humphries: The Vacuum published an article on God and Satan and the Council decided it was so offensive it would cut off the cash. Its editor Richard West is here on the line and so is the DUP councillor the Reverend Eric Smyth. What did you say Mr West about God and Satan that was so offensive? |
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| Richard West: This is something that we have never quite established we did two special dedicated issues, one to God and one to Satan. |
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| John Humphries: They were two separate issues? |
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| Richard West: Yes, two separate issues, but they came out at the same time. They had a number of different articles in them, so the God issue had in it an essay about sacred architecture and church iconography. We've never quite established what it was that upset anybody. |
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| John Humphries: What was in the Satan issue? |
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| Richard West: The Satan issue had different articles about the history of Satanism, things about stories of Satanism in Northern Ireland, an interview with an exorcist, those kinds of things. |
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| John Humphries: Right, well what was wrong with that Mr Smyth? |
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| Councillor Smyth: Well first of all the Christian issue is that they attacked two important evangelists in Northern Ireland, personally and their churches and one, Pastor McConnell of Whitewell church, one of the biggest churches in Belfast. They made reference to old people and people with disabilities and... |
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| John Humphries: You mean they were rude, they were offensive? |
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| Councillor Smyth: Yes, to anybody who has a disability and I know that Doctor McConnell is one of the great men for helping these people. Their are many of these people who are in their homes and can't go out and Mr McConnell organises transport for them to bring these people to the church. |
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| John Humphries: Right so it is nothing to do with their approach to Satan then, or God? |
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| Councillor Smyth: Oh yes all that's got to do with it, all that trying to link up the church with it. Some of the photographs were very offensive and one photograph shows you, as I can only see it, as a picture of Christ with another man lying on top of him, lying the opposite way. That's offensive to me and many other people. I must say now I never knew nothing about the magazine. It was actually members of the public that came in to the city council and asked for me and other councillors to raise a protest on this and wanted to know why the city council was supporting this type of thing. |
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| John Humphries: Well Mr West that presents a different picture than the one you described. |
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| Richard West: Yes, it's a complete travesty in fact. |
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| John Humphries: Well were you offensive about disabled people? Did you show picture of Jesus lying under another man? |
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| Richard West: No we didn't. In the article he is referring to somebody went around to different churches to see what kind of service they put on. He went to the church he was talking about and mentions in the article that there are mentally ill people and old people in the congregation. We have published issues in the past dealing specifically with social stereotypes, old people, in fact in the same issue there is a long essay that is very complimentary about the largest mental health institution in Northern Ireland. And we need take no lessons or lectures from Reverend Smyth or any of his colleagues about representing minority interests. |
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| John Humphries: But Mr Smyth even if there had been a degree of offence caused by some of these magazines that's what journalism is about, in part, isn't it? Some journalism is offensive to some people, so are books, we don't burn books do we? |
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| Councillor Smyth: No, but the difference is the Belfast city council is funding this, which is Belfast ratepayers money. Most papers are self supported and pay for their articles. I have no problem with criticism. It doesn't annoy me in the least because it doesn't stop my faith or belief at all, or the increase in our numbers, and people turning to Christ. But we are offended that I am a ratepayer of Belfast, my rates are being used in this way, who gives these people the right to say that there guaranteed any funding? The funding in Belfast is not guaranteed to any organisation it's only given year by year and we can stop it at any time because we might see something better to support. |
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| John Humphries: That is a fair point isn't it Mr West. Why should ratepayers subsidise your magazine? |
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| Richard West: Absolutely, that is a fair point, and if we wanted to talk about funding we could certainly have an interesting debate about funding, and we'd be very happy to do that. But of course it wasn't us who wrote the funding application and nowhere on that funding application will you read anything about 'you shall not be given money if you say certain things about Christianity'. |
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| John Humphries: Can you manage without it or will the paper have to close if you don't get the money? |
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| Richard West: I don't know. That all remains to be seen. We're funded by the Arts council here as well, who have no problem with what we are doing and everybody who contributes to the paper does it for nothing, so we have a lot of good will. I myself as an editor, probably not many editors say this to you, I don't get paid for what I do. |
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| John Humphries: No, not many editors say that. |
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| Richard West: It's the talent of the people of Belfast that being invested freely and generously in the paper. So we will go on with it. |
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